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Cider 1st try
Sun 23-Oct-11
8:16 am
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Barbara Good
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Tom is about to go off 1/2 cocked again! we have four trugs of apples picked yesterday semi sweet almost eaters.

Dimwits great plan is to run these through the juicer into a 40 litre beer container add sugar and a pillowcase full of the pulp and leave for a while????

then he plans on removing the pillowcase and syphoning off into glass demi johns with an airlock until fermentation stops then bottling!!!

 

Should i throttle him now or might this just work?

 

Babera

 

Help and suggestions please before i loose my apple crop.champagne

Sun 23-Oct-11
9:01 am
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SumpRat
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It might just work

A well fed rat is a HappyRat    A smile a day keeps the psychiatrist away.

Sun 23-Oct-11
11:10 am
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mike.
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You will certainly get some kind of cider out that way but I'd recommend adding some yeast instead of just leaving it to ferment naturally - I've found that normal bakers yeast works perfectly well for ciders and wines.

If you've got a hydrometer you can work out the eventual alcohol content so you can see how much sugar to add to make a certain strength. Whenever I've made ciders from cartons of apple juice, I just use whatever sugar is in the juice and end up with a 6.5-7% brew.

But I'd say go for it.

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Sun 23-Oct-11
5:29 pm
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kayerunrig
lincolnshire

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it works ive done it that way but with pears !!! its not bulmers but it does cause braindamage...lol

Fri 4-Nov-11
1:37 pm
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Noncitydweller
Lincolnshire

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Been using my spinner for a couple of days (for cider) I use a Garden shredder to cut the apples up. far better than my press BUT wrecking my muslin bags very quickly as it happens pub landlord insisted that his Indian shopping bags would do the trick and he was right. Cost him pennies and made out of a very heavy duty plastic brilliant but due to a bereavment have missed 2.5 weeks of cider making but should still make 20 gallons hopefully more. Got 6.5 gallons of Sloe gin on the go though¦¦¦Sloe Cider nothing in the world beats it.

I have also spent a consideable amount of time reading up on how to solve all the problems of grotty cider. IE trying to be more consistent. Below is shorened version of this http://www.cider.org.uk/part3.htm   Might be of use to anyone trying to get more consistency in there cider production. Note there are another 4 lots of info from the same source you may want to read.

 

 IF THE PH IS TO HIGH THE ACIDITY IS TO LOW ( LIKELY TO GO OFF)

Insipid? malic acid added in steps of 1 gram per litre (0.1%) until the balance is improved.

 

IF PH TO LOW THE ACIDITY WILL BE TO HIGH  (MUCH LESS LIKELY TO GO OFF BUT TO SHARP) If the juice is too acid encourage a malo-lactic fermentation  or you can add a little calcium carbonate to neutralise it, in 1 gram per litre steps. 

 

 

Measurement pH the nearest 0.1 pH unit

1/ a dedicated 'pH meter'. These used to  about £30 or so. Do not use garden ones

2/ Narrow range 'pH papers' (e.g. pH 2.8 to 4.2) Looking for 3.2 " 3.8

Higher pH fermentation subject to microbial infection. At pH 4.0 or above lead to serious flavour problems (? To bland??) NOTE by wide range (cheap) as well just in case as the juice maybe off the scale

 

Tannin, is difficult to measure, (caused by using to high proportion of bittersweet

 excessive tannin detected by taste??? although the juice sugar does tend to mask it. Deficiencies here can be corrected after fermentation,

 

IF TANNIN TO LOW ADD TANNIN OR LEMON JUICE BUT TANNIN IS BETTER OPTION AS IT PROTECTS FROM BACTERIA INFECTION.  NOTE PERFECT TANNIN CONTENT 0.2 BRAMLEYS 0.05 THERFORE 1 10TH OF WHAT YOU WOULD FOR. THIS REALLY SHOWS THE PROBLEM OF NOT HAVING AVAILABLE PROPER CIDER APPLES AND THEREFORE THE ADVANTAGE OF "DOING IT PROPERLY"

 

CLEAR CIDER

Add pectolytic enzyme may be added to ensure that all the pectin is broken down. Dessert fruit, or long-stored fruit, tends to suffer more from pectin

 

Yeast nutrient. Apple juices low in yeast fermentation rate will probably be much improved if you add these. Less likely to 'stick' or to grind to a halt before completion. Can be racked/bottled sooner, reduce chance of spoiling. On the other hand The finest ciders are fermented very slowly without the addition of nutrients, risks of failure are higher.

Sulphur Dioxide (Camden tablets). Note add yeast 24 hours after

sulphur dioxide inhibits the growth of most spoilage yeasts and bacteria, while permitting the desirable fermenting yeasts to multiply and to dominate the conversion to alcohol. small amounts of sulphur dioxide are used, effectiveness depends on the pH of the juice. Table shows the levels to use when a cultured yeast is being added for the fermentation. Lower levels are needed if a 'wild' Saccharomyces fermentation is required. Without sulphur dioxide, the fermentation less likely to be 'clean' possible to do without it. No sulphur dioxide remains free by the end of fermentation it is bound to various intermediate chemicals (principally acetaldehyde

Addition of Sulphur Dioxide 

Juice pH

SO2 needed in parts per million (ppm)

Campden Tablets per gallon or ml. of 5% SO2 stock solution per litre

Above 3.8 (insipid) ¦..Lower pH to 3.8 with addition of malic acid¦..
3.8 " 3.5 150  3
3.5 " 3.3 (balanced) 100 
3.3 " 3.0 50  1
Below 3.0 (sharp)  None None

 

Campden tablets are formulated with metabisulphite to give the equivalent of 50 ppm sulphur dioxide when each is dissolved in 1 gallon of liquid.

JB

Fri 4-Nov-11
11:30 pm
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Terrier
York

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gosh, this site has got very technical while I've been away for a week!!!

Sat 5-Nov-11
11:24 am
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Toffeeapple
North Bucks

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Welcome back Janet!  It is only this thread that has gone technical, thankfully.eeek

I'll try that again!

Sun 6-Nov-11
8:01 pm
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JoannaS
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Looked fine to me whistle and very interestingcheers

Wed 9-Nov-11
12:09 pm
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Noncitydweller
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Terrier  gosh, this site has got very technical while I've been away for a week!!!

Toffeeapple Welcome back Janet!  It is only this thread that has gone technical, thankfully

Not quite sure why either of you have a problem with my
posting particluly toffeapple as you are on this: -
œWordPress and general techie talk of computer-related
other gadgetry is this not technical?
Nobody is forcing you to read it. I did write this: - œMight be of use to anyone trying to get more consistency in their cider production

Wed 9-Nov-11
12:32 pm
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brightspark
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Hi, JB, don't take us lot too seriously - a sense of humour on this forum is an essential I've found!

brightsparklystuff

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Live life to express, not to impress
Don't strive to make your presence noticed
Just make your absence felt"
Wed 9-Nov-11
11:03 pm
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Terrier
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Hi JB- yes really sorry, I didn't mean to offend you, it was just a light hearted comment.

Mon 23-Jan-12
12:50 pm
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Noncitydweller
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   Excellent improvement in cider by following

IF THE PH IS TO HIGH THE ACIDITY IS TO LOW ( LIKELY TO GO OFF)

Insipid? malic acid added in steps of 1 gram per litre (0.1%) until the balance is improved.

Actually never used the above as I forgot that Insipid could be dealt with or caused by the above will have to check one lot of cider (about 5 gallons) as it is a little insipid. Although may be a tannin problem. will need to experiment.

 

IF PH TO LOW THE ACIDITY WILL BE TO HIGH  (MUCH LESS LIKELY TO GO OFF BUT TO SHARP) If the juice is too acid encourage a malo-lactic fermentation  or you can add a little calcium carbonate to neutralise it, in 1 gram per litre steps.

The latter worked wonders for some of my ciders improving them enormously.

   Tannin has has not turned out yet to be a great improver of my ciders where I think it is necessary. Early days though will have to keep working at it. May not use any of my own ciders for making Sloe cider this year as they SHOULD  all be good this year Will probably buy Kingstone Press Dry cider 660 mils for a pound as it work well with the sweet left over Sloes from my Sloe Gin production (6.5 Demijohns prior to decanting). By the way I bought some really nice 500 mil glass bottles with the old fashioned tops to bottle some of my Sloe Gin. I gave one to the local pub for its Christmas draw. They had about 50 prizes¦¦¦.you can guess what I won?

Thu 16-May-13
11:31 am
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Noncitydweller
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Just spoted a usefull way of stopping your cider bottles exploding. If you put cider while it is still fermenting in bottles the gas pressure may get to high and make the bottles explode (many times). If you kill the yeast before bottling, you will end up with flat cider. So put fermenting cider in bottles cap wait about 10 days (so the gas increase as you have let most of it out when bottling) heat a pan of water to 80 degrees take of the heat, place bottles in pan with lid on. Take out after 10 mins. This may pasturise them but the aim is to kill the yeast and it will certainly do that But the gas is in there so nice fizzy cider. AND you can stop cider fermenting and bottle when you are happy with the taste.   JB

Sun 19-May-13
9:21 am
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Rob12
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This is a very useful thread with good info thank you!

 

I bought a Kingston Black cider apple tree to go with my Devonshire Quarrenden  and am hoping to be able to make some cider later this year  (or next).

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