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Blight has struck my Tomatoes
Sat 21-Aug-10
11:05 am
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milkermel
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Ok Having a problem finding a recipe to use up a glut of green tomatoes that I have.  Unfortuneatley Blight has hit my greenhouse so have decided to pick green rather than go to waste.  a good chutney is in order I think!!!

Sat 21-Aug-10
11:52 am
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JoannaS
Latvia

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Definitely chutney but it does need leaving to mature for 10 months for the best flavour we found. It's okay after 6 months but 10 months is definitely better. Problem is my recipe is from a cookbook, does anyone know how old a book can be before it is declared out of copyright?

Sat 21-Aug-10
12:26 pm
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Toffeeapple
North Bucks

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Hello and welcome Melanie!

Joanna, surely if you post a recipe and give the credit to the writer/publisher, it should be OK?

I'll try that again!

Sat 21-Aug-10
12:32 pm
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Danny
Scarborough, England
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Hi Melanie, and welcome. There are loads of recipes out there. I just Googled for

green tomato chutney recipe

But we have never made it ourselves, so I cannot recommend any particular one.

Joanna, I believe 50 years is the duration of copyright before it enters the public domain. Also, somebody on here said that recipes are not subject to copyright law, but I would like to have that validated by somebody with relevant experience or authority.

However, I agree with TA - I am happy for you to reproduce it here with appropriate credits to the author and book.

Never knowingly underfed

Sat 21-Aug-10
3:26 pm
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devongarden
Devon, UK

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Copyright law is different in different countries. In the UK, if you have written it, you have the copyright, as I understand it, and I think it lasts for 50 years after the death of the author. Recipes are written, hence they are copyright. So give credit where it is due by quoting author, title, etc. In the same way if it is from a website, give the link!

It is one reason why there are so many recipes that vary only in one ingredient, or by very small amounts--it isn't copying then, technically, I suppose.

I found this recipe last year, when I had to pick all my tomatoes early because of blight. I really like it, and it uses vast quantities of green tomatoes easily. There are other pickle and preserve recipes in the book. They are often
for huge quantities, like the one for apple butter that starts with 20
gallons of apple juice--even with US gallons, that is a lot!

 

                   French Tomato Pickle (Old)

Mennonite Community Cookbook, by Mary Emma Showalter, The John C Winston Company, Philadelphia, 1950.

I will give the original quantities, then mine in brackets. t=teaspoon, T=Tablespoon

 

1 peck green tomatoes, sliced--this is 8 US quarts, nearly 8 litres   (8cups)

6 onions, sliced (1)

1 cup salt (1/4cup)

2 US quarts vinegar (2cups, 16 floz)

1 pound sugar (1/4 lb.)

2 teaspoons powdered mustard (1/2t)

2 tablespoons curry powder (1/2T)

2 tablespoons turmeric (1/2T)

2 teaspoons cinnamon (1/2t)

2 teaspoons cloves-I assume ground cloves! (1/2t)

2 teaspoons allspice, "             "       (1/2t)

 

Slice the green tomatoes and onions (I wanted a relish, so I put them in the food processor to get the texture I wanted)

Mix salt through them and let stand overnight.

In the morning, drain and allow to stand 15 minutes in a weak vinegar solution. (Your guess as to correct dilution for vinegar is as good as mine. This does NOT use the measured vinegar)

Drain.

Combine vinegar, sugar, and spices and bring to a boil.

Add vegetables and simmer slowly for 3 minutes.

Pack in jars and seal. (I did sterilize the jars first!)

This is a rich pickle.

The recipe is attributed to Mrs. Menno M. Brubacker, Waterloo, Ont., Can.

 

 

 

Sat 21-Aug-10
3:58 pm
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brightspark
Wilts

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Copyright is different for the different media, see here.

Literary, dramatic, musical or artistic & films - 70 years

Sound and broadcasts - 50 years

"Typographical arrangement of published editions" - 25 years 

Where would 'recipes' go in that lot ?!!

But, in 'point' 8, it describes what you can do - and, after reading it, I think that is open to interpretation, too !!!

I have to say that any recipe posted on this website is not intended for personal gain anyway, so I can't see a real problem with it - with the proviso of adding the origins.

brightsparklystuff

 

"Work for a cause, not for applause
Live life to express, not to impress
Don't strive to make your presence noticed
Just make your absence felt"
Sat 21-Aug-10
6:02 pm
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devongarden
Devon, UK

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Well done, brightsparklystuff , for finding that!

But do note that it says 70 years after the death of the last author of a work. So if you published your two year old's sweet sayings, and the two year old lived to be 110, it looks as if the coypright would last 178 years.eeek

I was told that copyright lasts 75 years in the US, but haven't checked the details

You cannot copyright an idea, so you couldn't copyright "mayonnaise". You can copyright the expression of an idea, so you could say for example "take exactly 1/7th of a teaspoon of mustard, very slowly add best quality olive oil, and beat furiously..." and that would be copyright, as I understand it. Recipes would be literary, I think, in the same way instruction manuals would be. confused It would be plagiarism to quote exactly without attributing it. If an author isn't listed or known it is still copyright for 70 years, unless it is made public within that time when it would be copyright for 70 years from date of publication.

The main thing to do to avoid problems is to say where you got the recipe!

Thanks to DD for some of the above information.

Sat 21-Aug-10
6:19 pm
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Toffeeapple
North Bucks

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What a wonderfully well-informed community we have here.  Thanks all!.

I'll try that again!

Sat 21-Aug-10
6:27 pm
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Danny
Scarborough, England
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Goodness me, it is a minefield, isn't it?. Thanks for that source, Val, and to your DD Barbara.

Well, I guess if any author/owner objects to using stuff on here then we will simply take it down. But it is good to see that we are all slight;y nervous about plagiarism.

Interestingly, Barbara, that Mennonite Community Cookbook is still available on A,azon. I guess there may have been several reprints. It is on my birthday list because it looks really interesting.

Never knowingly underfed

Sat 21-Aug-10
6:32 pm
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danast
Argyll, Scotland

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wave  Hope all that copyright stuff doesn't endanger the Data Base of recipes.  ( And that is only slightly tongue in cheek )

Old teachers never die, they just lose their class

Sat 21-Aug-10
6:33 pm
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Toffeeapple
North Bucks

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Are you still working on the Danuta?  

I'll try that again!

Sat 21-Aug-10
6:39 pm
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brightspark
Wilts

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Toffeeapple said:

Are you still working on the Danuta?  


 

TA, is "the Danuta" something we should know about?????????

Sorry, I'm mischief-making again - can't help it big_laugh   big_laugh

brightsparklystuff

"Work for a cause, not for applause
Live life to express, not to impress
Don't strive to make your presence noticed
Just make your absence felt"
Sat 21-Aug-10
6:43 pm
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Toffeeapple
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OOPS!  I meant to say, are you still working on that, Danuta?  embarassed Well spotted O Eagle-eyed one! big_laugh

I'll try that again!

Sat 21-Aug-10
6:47 pm
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danast
Argyll, Scotland

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wave  You wee imp you.  big_laugh

But to answer the real question, yes hope to be finished by the end of September.  I have been so busy, but have discussed it with Danny and he has been very understanding.  However the way recipes come onto the Forum, I don't think it shall ever really be finished.  big_laugh

Old teachers never die, they just lose their class

Sat 21-Aug-10
6:50 pm
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Toffeeapple
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Yes, I imagine it will always be a 'work in progress'.  Well done though, it must be such a lot of work. And thank you for taking it on.

Just had a thought, I'll be able to find Shereen's chicken thigh recipe when you've done. cheers

I'll try that again!

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